Building a Strong Foundation: The Critical Role of Early Childhood Development

Research on early childhood development is unequivocal: the first five years of life are pivotal to a child’s neurological, cognitive, and social-emotional growth. Today, Erin is joined by two experts in child development from the San Bernardino City Unified School District, Dr. Latashia Kelly and Nancy Carrillo, to discuss these formative years, their lasting impact, and what they are doing to make the most of them. 

Studies from Stanford University reveal a staggering reality: low-income 5-year-olds can be as much as three years behind in early numeracy and two years behind in literacy compared to their wealthier peers. While many catch up in later years, they never quite bridge the gap, as they continue to learn at the same pace as their more privileged classmates. The foundation laid between birth and age 5 is critical; it determines a child’s readiness for kindergarten. Students who start behind face an uphill battle to catch up, often struggling to overcome this early deficit throughout their education.

Transcript

Erin Brinker: 0:05

Good morning, everyone. You're listening to the making hope happen radio show, and I'm Erin Brinker. I say good morning because we air on two radio stations in Inland Southern California. That's X 95.7 and 92.5 KQLH on Sunday mornings at nine and 10am respectively. Okay, you're gonna love the conversation today. One of my passions is early childhood education and the strength of families. It's where most of my work in the nonprofit sector has centered, and where I think we can make the greatest impact in the health and stability of our communities and our nation, if you think about it, families are the core of everything. Families are the start of everything. You cannot hope to have a stable, productive, good, solid, safe community, if your families are chaotic, if your families are in turmoil. And so my work, in the work of many, many others, has been focused on strengthening families right from the very beginning, and it means Healing the Hurts of adults. It means making sure kids are ready for school, that they have nutritious food to eat, that they have a quiet place to sleep, that they you know, have people around them who love them. And in order for the adults to give the love, they need to feel the love, right? And so they need to be healed, and they need to be healthy so that they can focus on what's important, and that's their children and their spouses. And you know, because the best gift you can give to your kids is a solid, stable marriage relationship. Now, I'm a big fan of merit marriage. If you're just cohabitating, but you're providing that. I think that's good for kids too. So you know, I'm not judging your family structure. I'm just saying that a that a loving, predictable, supportive family home, is absolutely critical to human development. It's absolutely critical to everything. All right, so my next guest, actually, two guests are working in this field right now, specifically in early childhood development at the public school level, and there's a lot going on in that area now because of the addition of mandatory TK and focus on school readiness, etc. One last note, this was recorded before the election, so there's references to the election. It's because it was recorded before All right, here we go. Well, I am absolutely thrilled to be sitting down again with the director of child development from the San Bernardino City Unified School District, Dr Latasha Kelly and her newly minted coordinator for the program master's level, Nancy Carrillo, welcome both of you to the show.

Nancy Carrillo: 2:54

Thank you.

Erin Brinker: 2:55

So we're here to talk about early childhood. And anybody who who knows me personally or has been listening to any my radio shows over the last 15 years, knows that early childhood education is a major passion of mine. You know, how you start out in life really has a huge can hugely predict, or largely predict, what your life will be like as you grow older, both, you know, mental health and physical health and all of those things we know. There's lots of research on the adverse childhood experiences, for example, that's when 80% or 85% of neurological development happens in that first five years. So the window of those first five years are critical for that human as they grow up. So just to set the table, first of all, tell me about yourselves, and we'll start with you. Dr Kelly, what led you to choose early childhood education as a career? What's your background?

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 3:46

Well, honestly, I didn't know what I wanted to do after high school and into college until I took an early childhood class and was able to intern at the Child Development Center at Chaffey College. That changed everything. I absolutely loved working with the little ones birth to five, and so my I have 28 years in the field of early childhood, and I've worked with children from birth to 12 years old. I've been a teacher, a site supervisor, a coordinator, and currently a director for the San Bernardino City Unified School District Child Development Program.

Erin Brinker: 4:24

How about you? Nancy, so, okay, so

Nancy Carrillo: 4:28

I would say about 34 years ago, I was a teen mom, and I wasn't quite sure how to be a mother, right? So I thought the best bet was to take an early childhood education class, because it was very important for me to raise my daughter correctly, and that started my path into early childhood education. I took one class, the very core basic classes at San Bernardino Valley College, and I started at a family daycare. I went to a private. At corporate daycare, and eventually ended up here at the Child Development Program as an infant toddler teacher in 2001 I taught infant toddlers. I've taught three and four year olds. I also led a parent I was a parent educator for our teen parents, so I was able able to give back in that area. I then went on for my bachelor's degree, with the push from doctor Kelly, she would just always, always encourage all of us to get our education. And then about in 2018 I went back for my master's degree. I have become the newly appointed coordinator here, congratulations, yes. Thank you so much under the direction of Doctor Talley, and it's just, it's this is the most rewarding field that anyone can be in. I mean, just working, working with these, these precious children, from birth to two five and watching them grow so we It doesn't stop, right? It doesn't stop at five year olds. We just don't cut the cord and we never see them again. We've been invited to weddings and graduation. That's so great. Yes.

Unknown: 6:14

So love that

Nancy Carrillo: 6:16

these are lifelong relationships, and not only with the child, because sometimes a child doesn't remember you, right? They're so young, but with their family, so doctor Kelly and I both run into children all the time, all the time, and first, it usually starts with the parent. Of course, hey, I remember you. You're my child's teacher. And then they show us their adult child. You know

Erin Brinker: 6:39

this what used to be a little, tiny boy walks up, Hi, how you doing? I think you're Wow

Nancy Carrillo: 6:45

When they remember you from four and from three and four years old. I mean, you less than impact. Yeah, you've that's awesome. So that that that right there is the, the reason we do this. And you know, we both have our different reasons for starting in this field, but we're basically at the same point now where this this is just our passion, right? So

Erin Brinker: 7:07

this is, and I know many teachers at all levels who have talked about this, everyone thinks they could run a school or a daycare because, well, they were in school, they were children once. Of course, that isn't true. Tell me about your approach to early childhood education, and we could start with you. Dr Kelly,

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 7:26

well, first, you have to love children and have a passion for the work, and not just some children, but all children. Second, you need to have early childhood classes. Take many early childhood classes and get educated in the field of early childhood. And third, you have to know all about regulations, because there's so many entities involved and changing and changing all the time. Because you have, you know, CDE, which is the California Department of Education, you have the Department of Social Services, you have community care licensing. So there's so many entities with rules, regulations and mandates for running a school or early childhood program. So people, there's a lot of people out there that think all it is is just, you know, telling teachers what to do with their the children. No, it's, it's not that first. You have to love the children first, and know early childhood, and know all the mandates involved,

Nancy Carrillo: 8:32

right? And some think it's, it's as simple as, you know, this is a taboo word. We hate this word. They think it's as simple as babysitting. It's hot, it's not. It is far more. It is far more than that. I

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 8:44

mean, which is a pet peeve of ours? Oh

Nancy Carrillo: 8:46

yes, big pet peeve. So you can't just, you can't just open your doors and say, I'm going to run a daycare from my home. There is so much state requirements and but it's not impossible. So if it is your passion is something you want to do, then I suggest you start with knowing the rules and regulations. Look at them all. There is so many. And as the as the newly appointed Coordinator here at the department, I am still learning them. And when you think you've learned them all, no, yeah. News coming out. So this, it's great to have a mentor. Find a mentor who knows the program, and you know, they can help you through understanding these rules and regulations. Because it's not as simple as, you know, oh, it's only 12 to 112, children to one adult. You know, it's so much more. So much more. You

Erin Brinker: 9:41

know, I when I had two kids in in two years, and so because I had two in diapers, it didn't, it didn't make sense for for us to for me to work, because I would have been everything I earned, would have gone to childcare. And so I opened up a licensed childcare center in my home, and I was shocked by. How much there was to get set up, to get on the food program, to to, you know, I took, obviously, read everything I could read and, and I have a bachelor degree, but it was in political science. There wasn't a whole lot of early, early childhood development going on. So I read everything that I could. And it was, I mean, I loved it, and I'm very, very grateful that I had the opportunity to do it, but I've never worked so hard in my life.

Nancy Carrillo: 10:24

That's an everyday job.

Erin Brinker: 10:26

Yes, daycare, yes,

Nancy Carrillo: 10:30

even on your week hours. Yes,

Erin Brinker: 10:32

I was sick, you can't, and I was up at 5am making sure that everything was clean and ready and prepped, that everybody's diapers were in, and everybody, all the BOP the the little, everybody had their little cubbies, and they were all full, and all the toys were clean and mopped the floors and get breakfast started, because my first kids got dropped off at 6am and and then at the end of the day, it was, you know, cleaning up everything at night. That's when I mopped the floors. Was at night, and, you know, and it was, it was, it was 12 to 15 hours a day. I loved it. I'm really glad I did it, but my hat's off to you. There is so much to making everything you know up to code and running the way that that they should. And when I put the kids down for a nap, holy cow, I would sit on the couch and just veg

Nancy Carrillo: 11:18

and and even running running the program here, you know, you you would think that, oh, okay, we work seven to four. No, no, no, no, to run an efficient center. I mean, I mean doctor Kelly and I are talking at night. Sometimes are working on a shared document, you know, because this is such a passion of ours, and because we know the impact that we're making on the community and with the children and the support we want to give to the teacher. It is, it's a long day, but it's, but it's, it's worth it, because love what we are doing exactly well.

Erin Brinker: 11:52

And to put it in perspective, it's not work, yeah, it's a it's a passion, but it's, it is work. I mean, to put it in perspective, every experience for the children has to be prepped and planned, and so it's, it's not an accident. When they're when they experience, they have enriching play, and they have, you know, experiences that that are brain developing and social, emotional developing and and cognitive they create. You know, cognitive development, you know, is going on during the school day. That's not an accident,

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 12:23

right? It's all planned. It's all prepared. Yeah, it's it's all intentional, intentional.

Erin Brinker: 12:29

So what does learning look like for very young children? How? How are they different? So how do they learn?

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 12:37

Well, it looks like hands on experiences. It looks like a lot of play and happy children who are engaged in activities with their peers and educators. And when you say, how do they learn? They learn through play and hands on experiences. So educators should be setting up learning experiences that provide children with that rich language, number, concept, music and movement, science, outdoor play art. There's so much children can learn within a day. And

Nancy Carrillo: 13:06

not only that, but the main word is fun. You know, yes, fun. Our children, I don't even think they realize they're going to school. Yeah? So great, very excited. , because Yeah they're they're coming in, excited to be here. They're, they're not coming to a daycare, you know? They're coming to a school where we have a curriculum. We use frog street curriculum, which is very language rich in both English and Spanish. It's very socially, emotionally driven. We, you know, and also we, we also have dual language preschools, yes. So, you know, some of our kids, you know, that don't know Spanish, are coming into our program, are leaving our program bilingual, because they're getting 5050, English and Spanish. So,

Erin Brinker: 13:57

so I remember being in kindergarten getting we had an aide in the classroom who was bilingual, and she was teaching us how to count in Spanish. I was five, and I still remember, you know, what she taught us. And I remember her, I remember, right? I don't remember her name, unfortunately, but I do remember her face and and what they're like, little sponges at that age. What a great time to teach them another language. Yeah,

Nancy Carrillo: 14:21

right, and, and where we have dual language preschools, but all of our infant toddler centers, there's, there is bilingual staff in every one of our centers. So it might not be a dual language infant toddler classroom, but they are hearing the language, especially if it is their home language. We, you know, really embrace that.

Erin Brinker: 14:45

So what are you seeing with the little ones that concern you? Are they learning like they should be? Are they ready like they should be? Are they socially and emotionally ready? What are you seeing?

Unknown: 15:00

So, what concerns me are, when we get four year olds, or, you know, who come to us who are not potty trained, and parents say they can't be potty trained, yeah, and can't is not in our vocabulary, right? Yes, when children come to us, we have a plan of the teacher, you know, creates a plan of action with the parent on how we're going to potty train their child, and they're potty trained in no time. What? Days, weeks? Yes. And so when parents come in and say, Oh, they can't be potty trained or we don't want to potty that's just a disservice to their child, and that concern that really concerns, yeah, I'm thinking,

Erin Brinker: 15:45

does that parent think they're gonna, it's their 45 year old is still gonna be wearing a diaper? Of course, they could be body trade,

Nancy Carrillo: 15:52

right? And what's, what's so amazing about this is the children learn so quickly. Yeah? I mean, they walk in with a pull up, they're leaving, you know, fully, fully potty trained within days, because they're watching their peers. Yeah,

Erin Brinker: 16:08

say, how much? How much is that peer interaction plays into that,

Nancy Carrillo: 16:12

a lot, a lot, because our our bathrooms are opened and, um, you know, there's really no expectation of privacy in the preschool classroom for their safety. So they they are, you know, when we say, Hey, we're, let's go potty. We're all going potty. You know, we have a line of children getting ready to take care of business, and they're doing it. And these ones that are that, these three and four year olds that are coming in, not potty trained, they are catching on,

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 16:40

right? And they want to mimic what their period? Sure, sure. Well, they

Erin Brinker: 16:44

don't want to be the baby, right, I'm a big kid.

Nancy Carrillo: 16:48

And another concern is the problem solving. You know, we're seeing a lot of challenging behaviors, a lot of aggression, a lot of hitting. So, you know, we have PBIS, which is our positive behavior intervention supports that we implement in our classrooms. We are working on tier one interventions, which means we are teaching our children the expectation in the classroom so they're just not coming in, like, hey, free for all. It's there's there's expectations, there's rules, there's procedures for everything, and they're all geared to meet them developmentally. So for instance, if we're in the classroom, I was a four year old teacher, and I asked the children, alright, come on. And I had a new student, I said, Alright, everybody, we're going to clean up, Clean up, clean up. So I have this little four year old who just started, and she's walking behind me, mimicking me, yes, Clean up, clean up, clean up. Clapping your hands. I said, No, sweetie, you need to go clean up your toys. And she she literally looked at me and said, Miss Nancy, what does that mean? Really, yes, because parents are doing that for them. Yeah, right. Which I get it, you're not teaching those skills. You know? It's, it's faster for us to go into the child's room at home and just put all their toys away than it is to sit there and teach them how. So when, when I realized that I came up with an idea of, okay. What does cleanup mean? Well, it means stock what you're doing, put your toys away, put them where they belong. That's why we have individual pictures on every single cabinet in our classrooms. Which is Eckers early what is Eckers early childhood? Environmental waiting

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 18:38

skills? Yeah. So we have it for infants and toddlers as well, right? So

Nancy Carrillo: 18:41

it those, it's like those things that are that are concerning to us, but we embrace that, right? We embrace that. We teach it. And not only do we teach it to the children, when their parents see what they're doing, because we have open door policy, they're like, how did you get them to do

Erin Brinker: 18:58

that? And we teach the parents, Oh, see, that's good, yes. So yeah,

Nancy Carrillo: 19:02

I'd love to talk more about PBIS, but that's probably a whole,

Erin Brinker: 19:06

whole different conversation. Yes. So I remember getting my little ones to clean up, and we would sing the Barney cleanup song, yeah, I don't know what people still do that, but it, you know, they would sing it and put their little toys away. And you know that that helped, because they when they heard the song, they knew it was time to pick up their toys. Now, one of my kids is on the spectrum, so it was still a little challenging to switch gears. So he needed lots of warnings, 15 minutes, 10 minutes, five minutes, you know, right? And that's

Nancy Carrillo: 19:37

what we're doing in the classroom, right? We have a lot of children on the spectrum, we have inclusion. We're all inclusive. So if your child's on the spectrum, we're not going to say, oh, send them to a sped sped classroom, a special ed classroom. We embrace that. We want to work with them. We have daily schedules that we follow in order to help that child be successful. We have timers. We. Um, there's so much we do in the classroom to help that child thrive and be successful and

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 20:08

develop needed skills, right?

Erin Brinker: 20:10

So, and that's hard, because I know you know when, when he started. Now, my son was, was in some ways, very, very gifted. He was reading at three, but in in other ways, he was, he was way behind his peers, the social, emotional, the self regulation, all of that. And so transitions in school, like any transition was, they were really, really tough, and sometimes he did them well, and sometimes he just wasn't up for it, and would melt down in class. You know, what do you what is your approach when something like that happens? Oh, my goodness.

Nancy Carrillo: 20:43

Behaviors. I love behavior, yes. So when with special Yes, that's my passion, because I know that they're not being intentional, trying to get under our skin, right? They're trying to communicate something to us. So when something like that happens, luckily, we're at an eight to one ratio, and we are able not to provide one on one, but able to provide a little bit more support, give the child a little bit more time when those meltdowns happen. We are able to

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 21:13

anticipate what is going to happen, because we know that child right, because

Nancy Carrillo: 21:17

we have them for so long in the classrooms, we get to know the families. So we really try to give the child the tools before the meltdown happens. So if we notice that transitions are difficult for children, then we give that child a job, right? So it's not really so much of a transition for him. He's got a job to do now. Mm, hmm,

Erin Brinker: 21:38

excellent idea.

Nancy Carrillo: 21:40

Yeah, we're lining up. So your job now is to make sure you know, to be the line leader, to count our friends, to flash the lights on and off. That gives us that signal. And we do a lot of visuals we I mean. And when I say visuals, I don't mean that they're on the wall. They are on our person, right? They are hanging from lanyards. They're in our apron pockets to to show the child, okay, we're going to be cleaning up. We allow them to hold the timer so we really try to get in front of the meltdown. But, but it still happens, right? It still happens their children, and we just give them their space. We allow them to fill those feelings. We allow them to, you know, flip their lid to say, and once they're able to comprehend and listen. Because who can listen when you're at a level 10, right? Yeah, you

Erin Brinker: 22:34

just can't. There's no communication going on. You can't. You can't communicate

Nancy Carrillo: 22:38

with a child that's already in a full on mountain. We let it happen. We make sure they're safe, we let them cry, and we're very close by, right, very close by. And when they're ready, it give them that nice, that nice hug and say, Okay, now let's go try it again. You know, let's try it again. And we learn every day from our students, yeah, so what worked today might not work tomorrow, you know? So every day, every day we learn and we try to meet the needs of the child, because every day could be different.

Erin Brinker: 23:10

You know? It makes me think, and I think that's wonderful. You know, they call three year olds three majors, because they are, they are really feeling their independence at that point, and but they have absolutely no judgment and no frame of reference. They just are are recognizing that they're individuals, that they're separate from mommy, and you know, all of that, yes. And so, you know, talk to me. Talk to me about some of the Defiance issues and, and this is not only advanced advice for child, you know, childcare providers and early education teachers and but also for parents and grandparents, right? You know, as their as their kids are being defiant, it's age appropriate, but it's maddening. So kind of talk about some of the tools, some of the things that they might be able to do to to work through those issues.

Nancy Carrillo: 23:59

So, one thing that I find very powerful is talk to your child about what they can do, not what they can't do. You know, get off the couch, put your feet on the you know, get your feet off the table, cuz that's all they hear, right? No, don't stop. Yeah, right. So we have to take those words out of our vocabulary. There's three, they're four. They're testing boundaries. It's about what they can do. You know, what's it? Yes, what can you do? He's swinging his sweater in the air. Hey, buddy, you can either hold your sweater or Mommy can hold your sweater. You can either hold your sweater or we can put it in your cubby. But one thing that we're not going to say is, Don't swing your sweater like that. You're going to hit somebody,

Erin Brinker: 24:41

because then it'll just become a helicopter, because he'll just do

Nancy Carrillo: 24:44

it's about what you can do, not what you can't do. So you can hold your sweater, or I can hold your sweater. You can hold your sweater, or we can put it in your cubby. You can sit on your bottom on the couch, or you can sit on your bottom on the floor. Right? It's, we're not saying, Don't put your feet on

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 25:02

the couch, right? Stop, don't that's just so negative, and it gets the child that

Nancy Carrillo: 25:06

is, that is what PBIS is, positive behavior in a courts. It's about what you can do, not what you can't do.

Erin Brinker: 25:14

So I have to think that you come against some family cultures that are are some are more disciplined than others, right? And you know, from family to family, it can vary widely, where some some families are just, let's just say, more animated than others, and then they come to school and they're getting different direction. How do you how do you navigate those waters? Because you want to support the parent, but you also the child has to know how to behave in public. And so what does that look like for you?

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 25:43

Well, that's when we sit down with our parents and go over whatever it looks like, you know. So we like to meet, not just a regular parent conference, you know, talking about development, but we want to make sure we have a relationship with our parents. Sit down with our parents. So what do you do at home when he does this? Or what do you do? What do you do at home when your child does this? How can we work together as a team to help your child? And that's why we have parent meetings to go over different topics needed for parents. And a lot of times on our parent survey, parents will state what they need, and we provide them with those topics. Oh, not

Nancy Carrillo: 26:27

only that. I mean, culturally, we will come into some differences where the parent, like you said, is a little more animated. They are just disciplinarians, and it's like they are not doing this. I They are not. For instance, I don't want my children to get dirty. Don't let them get dirty. You know that that's a real big pet. That is a big one, yeah, in our early childhood, because that's how they learn. You know, I had a little girl who wanted to be a cat, so she crawled everywhere, everywhere, and, oh, her mother would get so mad, her father would get so mad. So my suggestion was, how about we bring her to school, some play clubs, you know, let's just always have these specific pants on, because during this two weeks, it wasn't that long, right, that she wanted to be a cat, but she'd seen a video something, you know, and then she wanted to play in the dirt. She wanted to play in the mud. And it worked out. It worked out, you know, we were able to talk with the parent. We were able to suggest parenting classes. Our teachers are teaching these parenting classes. So it's not like it's an unfamiliar adult talking to you about your child. You've already built a relationship with the teacher. So our teachers teach monthly parenting classes to their parents and any other parent that wants to join on on what we're doing in the classroom to help not only the families but the child thrive with these challenging behaviors and to meet the needs of the parents. Because you're right, there are cultural differences, and we do respect those and but we always come to the same goal, I guess, understanding, yeah, the same understanding is we're just here to help your child. That's all we're trying to do. We're here to help coach all about

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 28:10

the child at the end of the day. Sure.

Erin Brinker: 28:13

You know, I was thinking about family culture, just in our own family. My father in law grew up, he was one of six on a farm with no running water or electricity. Of course, this is in the 40s, when he was a child. And they eventually got it all. But at the time, they didn't have it and it they were just a rowdy group, group of boys, one one daughter. So five boys, one girl. And, you know, so we would joke that Jack, who was ended up being a very, very, very successful man. But you know, when it when the when they food was served family style, he would dive in and pile on his plate, not looking at whatever anybody else was getting, because in his family, if they didn't do it, you didn't get it right away. You weren't going to you weren't going to eat. And so whereas other families, like, you know, you you kind of look around make sure everything's, you know, given out evenly, and that sort of thing. And you're thinking about family culture that's, you know, versus, you know, exactly, portioning out each plate versus, you know, a free for all and to each each party, each family, that was normal, right? And so, you know, when I'm talking about family culture, that's kind of the things, you know, some are very loud at the dinner table. Some eat all their dinner in front of the TV. Some, you know, and and so they come to school, kind of their first what, what they've always known to be normal maybe isn't normal for other families. And so you have to kind of cross that with parents and cross that with the kids so that they learn what's

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 29:45

expected of what's, yeah, what's

Erin Brinker: 29:47

expected of them. That's

Nancy Carrillo: 29:48

good, right? And you, you're talking about that. I mean, it's not only just like meals and food, it's, it's some, some families come in and they're huge sports fans, right? And all this child wants to do. Was, play football, play football. Which leads me to really just kind of toot our own horn here, you know, we have Heisman Trophy winner, Jaden Daniels, right? Do we do? And he started at our schools, you know. He started in our infant, toddler classrooms, you know. And we know that,

Erin Brinker: 30:17

right? So, great,

Nancy Carrillo: 30:18

yeah, we embrace that love of whatever it is, you know, he was throwing balls. And we're out there. You know who, who would have known you would been played for what you place, for Washington. Now, you know who, who have known, you know, but that's you know. We embrace these cultures that are coming in, whether it be sports are food are the way you discipline. You know, we want to embrace and support families.

Erin Brinker: 30:49

Excellent, excellent. So, um, if money were no object, what would a perfect school or school environment for the in for Inland Empire children look like,

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 31:03

it would look like a state of the art early childhood center that encourages ongoing engagement, indoor and outdoor learning, exploration and unique, a unique design element. And it would also look like providing experiences that may they the children may not get at home, like field trips to places they would not normally go to.

Nancy Carrillo: 31:32

I'm thinking also it would be an environment where, you know, we have lower ratios, you know, because, of course, we have to pay staff, so maybe some lower ratios to help with those with those special needs students, a little bit more one on one, maybe to help have a little more intimate, intimate time with the children who's struggling with those meltdowns, who's struggling with potty training. So if money were no object, I think I would have maybe, maybe a couple more staff members who are fully educated, and maybe in early childhood. Yeah, in early childhood, but with like, like ABA knowledge, which is

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 32:15

applied behavior analysis.

Nancy Carrillo: 32:16

Yes, are somebody who's like, demonstration teachers, for our teachers that are struggling on how to hold attention. So, you know that that that would be ideal, you

Erin Brinker: 32:30

know, I am. I've, I've seen articles and talk to people about various philosophies about early childhood and the Scandinavian model of of kind, of the forest school where, of course, they have very dense forests there, but just being where, that's where the kids have access to being outdoors. And there's different textures, and there's different, you know, trees and leaves and rocks and dirt and, you know, different surfaces and and all of that, where kids can experience and explore. There are things to climb and things to, you know, throw and things to just engage their bodies. And I know that that school campuses have those things, you know, that maybe not, maybe not the forest itself, but there's lots of play space and lots of places to stretch, stretch their bodies and stretch their minds. You know, I, I would love the idea of of that. Now, obviously it may not be a forest, because water is an issue for us. Maybe it would be, I don't know. You know, have you all had discussions about kind of expanding in that way?

Nancy Carrillo: 33:33

We actually have. We, we are trying to incorporate outdoor gardens into our centers. We encourage the outdoor learning. So when you go outside, it's not just about riding bikes and playing on slides and swings. It's about being able to explore in the grass. Have circle time outside, eating our meals outside in a sanitary environment, because we don't co mingle with K 12. So we usually have our own play area, so we're able to really incorporate a more outdoor learning environment. All of our classrooms are play based, and we try to include, like, especially at meals, the family style eating. So, you know, bringing that to our students, allowing them to see that. Hey, you know, the adults are sitting down with us, eating as well and having these conversations at the table. We're able to do outdoor learning, like with mud and what is that other texture we have on the grounds? The chips, the chips, you know. So we utilize all this stuff, the tree branches, the tree bark, the brass, the lady bugs, the environment. We try to bring all that and allow children to explore just the typical outdoor environment of the classroom, bringing the indoors outdoors, right, putting all that even into. Science areas, bringing in telescopes, microscopes, microscopes, microscopes, yes, into the classroom so they can really look at things like this. I was at a center and there was a cricket, just a simple cricket. The kids are screaming in the classroom because it was a cricket. So I just went over there and grabbed it with my hand, and I put it in a jar, and the kids were just frantic that they weren't touched it, that I just touch it. The teacher, the teacher was, I would have been, and I just grabbed my hand, and I put it in a center, and I grabbed a magnifying glass, and we kind of looked at it, and then we gently put it back out into the wild, you know, put it back out into a bush or something. A beetle comes blind by, and everybody's screaming, you know, I just reach out and grab it. Oh, you know, let it crawl on my hand. It's like, but, of course, so

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 35:52

amazing.

Erin Brinker: 35:52

I bet they are. I'm right. I was with you with the cricket. I don't know that one of those big buzzing green beetles. I don't think I could pick that out of the air,

Nancy Carrillo: 36:00

yeah, yeah. And it's not so bad. They don't hurt you. They're just loud. It's just, they are loud, yeah, it's just an ugly sound. But the kids are just, yeah, they love it. And we try to, you know, show them to to also be gentle. We're not stomping on, you know, ladybugs and bees and we're this is their environment too. So let's just put them out near the trees. Let's let it go, you know. So it's a lot of fun,

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 36:26

but everything is play based.

Erin Brinker: 36:29

Say that again, I'm so sorry. Everything is

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 36:31

just play based and exploration. Yeah, in our in our program, and

Erin Brinker: 36:38

let's be honest, we adults like that too. That's why we go camping. That's why we, you know, travel to different places. That's why we try new foods. You know, that that's a little bit of the child within us, that's that still loves to do those things, and it needs to be embraced, right?

Nancy Carrillo: 36:54

And and now that you say that, you know, the trying new foods, we had a nutrition program that would come in once a month, and they would bring us different fruits or different vegetables. And we were we would be able to let the children try all avocados, carrots, I know, papaya, zucchini, just different things. And, you know, some would try it. Some would be daring and and they would try it. Others, they wouldn't, but they would see their peers, and they're like, Okay, well, maybe I'll, I'll look a little closer at it all or or I'll smell it or something. But we try to create those experiences for the children as well. That's great, well, and it's

Erin Brinker: 37:31

certainly if you have, you know, if you all end up putting a garden in at, say, the all red, excuse me, child development center, you know, kids are more likely to eat food that they've grown themselves, exactly, right?

Nancy Carrillo: 37:41

And that was fun. We did do that. When I was there, we were growing some. It was just like basil and cilantro, because that was the easiest to grow. But they managed that area, you know, they went out and they watered it, they went out and they we pulled weeds.

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 37:56

They really wanted to take care of it, because they're stairs, right?

Nancy Carrillo: 37:59

And then when the when we were able to pull bunches off and send home with them, it was, it was pretty exciting.

Erin Brinker: 38:06

So all of this, and this is, I mean, it's been such a great discussion, it begs the question about workforce, because, you know, the kids do have a they they need a higher teacher to student ratio than, say, in a in a K 12 classroom, they need more, one on one, and they need people who are educated, highly educated, in that to give them the best experience. Unfortunately, typically, child development staff don't get paid as well as say, you know, other teachers maybe that's changed. Kind of talk about that environment, the difficulty in recruiting, and then some of the things that you want people who are maybe thinking about early childhood development as a career to know.

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 38:46

So right now, we have High School Pathways where children, well high seniors are interested in early childhood, and they are being introduced to early childhood via these pathways and so also community outreach. You know, we do a lot of but when it comes to choosing the career, we always tell folks, you have to have a passion. And when it comes to money, private schools, private early childhood development centers, don't get paid as much as they would at a district.

Erin Brinker: 39:36

Well, that makes sense, because private schools, K 12, are paid less, too, aren't they?

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 39:42

No, it's a lot different, and it depends, because private schools are title 22 instead of Title Five, so there's different fundings. So it depends on the fundings, but district, if you are. Are employed by the district, you're more likely to have a higher paying teacher job, you know, with our field, then you would a private sector.

Erin Brinker: 40:14

Well, that's good. So, so okay, if you're interested in early childhood development, work hard to get in at a district. So, you know, right? Is the best way to start out as an aid while you're going to school. Do you, you know, how do you, how do people start? Can

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 40:30

you can start as an intern, you can start as an aide. And we have employed plenty of teachers that has been recreational aids, instructional aids. We like to, we like to hire our AIDS, right? Yes, right.

Nancy Carrillo: 40:48

I started off as a recreational aid with the with the summer new school district, so that kind of got my foot into the district. And then I became infant toddler teachers. So that's where you're going to get your most experience, and that's where you're going to find out if you have the passion and love for children, right? Because if you can't do the recreational instructional aid job, then maybe this isn't the job for

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 41:11

you. If you don't like it and you don't care for it, then don't go on to teach great

Erin Brinker: 41:16

well. And kids can feel when you don't like them. They know they're very intuitive.

Nancy Carrillo: 41:22

Yes, they know. They know. And they know. The thing about kids is they're, they're resilient, right? They can have a horrible day, kick you, throw a chair at you. I don't know, you know, I'm just talking about a horrible day, but the next morning, they're so excited to come in and see you. Yep, you know, nothing happened. Yeah, they're just so they're so excited to see you, whereas we're like, you just whatever you learn from the kids. They're like, Yeah, but Today's a new day. Mm, hmm, today's okay, like, you're right, buddy, Today's a new day, and I'm happy you're here with me. I still love you. Yeah? So that's the type of passion. You have to let it go. You have to let it go. But doctor Kelly and I have an open door policy. So we are willing to talk to community. We're willing to talk to our AIDS. We're willing to guide those that are truly, truly interested. But you're going to get the brutal, honest truth from us. If you don't have the passion, you can't work for us. If you don't love children, you can't work for us. And that isn't just from our something that we believe in, but that's what our superintendent has said to many of us, you have to want to work with children, not the perfect child that listens and comes to school and gets in line and does their work. But all children, even the one that gets under your skin, because they need us the most. Yup, you have to work with all children. So if anybody is out there and you want to become an early childhood education teacher, give us a call over here we will. We would love to talk with you and

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 42:59

get you started. Right Track, right?

Nancy Carrillo: 43:01

Our aids are constantly calling us, what do I need to do? What do I need to do? And, you know, doctor Kelly and I, we just, we give them the matrix, we try to set them on their right foot to start working towards that goal. Because we need teachers. We need teachers as our new teachers are coming in. You know, our older teachers are leaving. They're retiring. They're enjoying life. Sure, you know, so we need teachers. We need good teachers that want to make a difference in the lives of children.

Erin Brinker: 43:34

So I in the kits program, the DR Albert Carnegie toddler Success program that I've been involved with, and we have a partnership with the district that we're very grateful for. You know, we have seen parents who you think Junior might need to be assessed because maybe they're on the spectrum, maybe there's a developmental delay, maybe there's something going on and the parents are not open to hearing that feedback, you know, and I know that you all are very straightforward and very direct, I mean, not in a rude way, but very direct in a productive way. And you know, how do you deal with parents that are that are kind of intractable or in denial? That's great. Yeah, they're living in Egypt.

Nancy Carrillo: 44:16

You know what I never heard that? You know? What we try to do is we try to show the parents, right? If you're in denial, you're not going to believe it, because all you see is your child and your baby, yeah, and and you have nothing in comparison. Not we compare children, but they're all different, yeah? Because they are all different, but we invite that parent to come in and support us, right? So if your child's hitting, and we believe there might be some developmental delays, of course, that's not our expertise, but we do have that experience with many children. So we'll invite the parent, hey, can you come in and kind of support us with your child? And that way they will see. See that 80% of our children are able to do this right, but your child is having some difficulties, maybe an assessment might be something you want to do. So we don't ever push them to do something they don't want to do, but we try to educate them, educate them and give them the resources to help

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 45:21

their child grow, right, to be successful, you know. And then, you know, at that point, parents will reevaluate their thoughts and say, Well, maybe they do need to, you know, get assessed. Maybe I want my child to be assessed so they can, you know, be successful, right? We also,

Nancy Carrillo: 45:39

we also have a developmental screening, which is called Ages and Stages Questionnaire. So if the parent is still in denial, we will have them fill out this questionnaire, which is social emotional, and they will be able to see that it asks some very developmental questions and see where they land. Yes, they can do it. No, they can't do it. Or, yeah, sometimes they can do it, and we score this, and we're able to show them where their child is falling. And we can either ask them, okay, now take this to your primary, or we give them some tools on how to help their child be successful in some of the areas where they were low. Or we can say, let me get you in touch with our sped department, which we have an amazing, yes, preschool, special education preschool department that would be happy to help with the assessment or either or even just some guidance,

Erin Brinker: 46:34

because you know that, especially with when you're seeing the kids, if you're talking about autism, which is the area Where I have lived experience. I'm not an expert. The earlier you diagnose and then set up, start working with the child and set up the family so that they understand what this means for the child, and you do the early intervention, that's the word I was looking for, the better, the more likely it is for them to be able to to adapt and be able to live their life. I mean, they're always going to be neurodivergent, but there are, but they certainly can be be taught, and they certainly can learn, if they're high functioning, to to exist in this world and find a happy life for themselves. But if you wait too long that the the likelihood of that intervention being successful diminishes,

Nancy Carrillo: 47:24

right, right? And I think parents are also worried that if they're assessed, they're labeled, if they're assessed, they will have to go into a special ed classroom. And we hear that a lot, right? And that's not the case. We have inclusion classrooms, where our classrooms are all inclusive. So just because your child is on the spectrum. Just because your child may have some developmental delays doesn't mean they have to go into a special ed classroom,

Erin Brinker: 47:47

but that's new. I know even when my kids were little, there was the inclusion wasn't a thing. The you were assessed, you were bam, you were in sped, whether that was best for you or not. And so that's changed. And so parents may be thinking, well, I know when I was a kid what it was like, and they don't realize that, that we understand so much more now,

Nancy Carrillo: 48:09

yeah, right. And they don't realize the authority they have. They're their child's first teacher. They have a right to say, Okay, this is what you diagnose them, but I do not want them in a special ed classroom. I want them in a general ed classroom, and if they will thrive in that area, then we will support that. We absolutely want to work with every single child and our teachers, you know, they're on board. They they will get the experience and the knowledge and the education. We will send them to trainings to help to meet those needs of the children.

Erin Brinker: 48:44

Oh, that's excellent. That's excellent. I love that because, you know, it's scary, and we have seen and and I've known people that they didn't want the diagnosis, because there's nothing wrong with my kid, and they don't want them with the label, right? They're they're embarrassed about the label, and what does that mean? And my kids just fine and and the reality is, it's it's just finding a way that could work the best for your child to learn and be successful, right?

Nancy Carrillo: 49:11

And that that label allows you to do that, you know it? Well, I take that back. It's not a label that diagnosis exactly allows you to to do that. You know, my son, I always thought that he was add. So I had him tested, and it wasn't. I didn't get him tested because I wanted to put him on medication. I got him tested so that I can do more research on what I can do to better meet his needs, right? You know, because putting him on medication or putting him in any special school was out of the question. It was just more for me to do my child right, right, because I knew at that young age of having children that I knew I had a right to my own child and their education. So parents need to understand that you have a right to your child's education and what you feel is best for them.

Erin Brinker: 49:59

Well. I gotta say, you must have, as a young parent, it's so proactive. You must have freaked some teachers out.

Nancy Carrillo: 50:07

I freaked my parents out, my own personal parents, you know, because I just wasn't going to go into this blindly. You know, I knew that I did not want my child because it's a it's a rolling ball, right? You have a baby at a young age. Your children have babies that, you know, unfortunately, it's generational, sure. So I knew that I had to educate myself. I knew I had to be there for my children. I knew it was going to be hard. And, you know, to say that I was a successful parent, you know, I don't know. I don't know, but my children are grown. They have degrees and they weren't teen parents, so yay for that, you know. But you know, it's a lot. Don't

Erin Brinker: 50:47

we all feel like that, though? To say we were, I was a successful parent,

Nancy Carrillo: 50:52

nope, nope, many, many errors, many fails, you

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 50:56

know, and that's gonna be normal, right,

Nancy Carrillo: 50:58

right, but you know, they didn't follow down the they didn't follow the life that I led. You know, being a young mother, you know, they they both had children once they were married and in, you know, their early, late 20s. So it's doable. So the mistakes we make as parents, don't beat yourself up, don't beat yourself up, just educate yourself, right? Educate yourself. And, you know, educate your children. Be honest, be loving, be you know, and and guide our children. You know, some of our parents are just they're so overwhelmed, you know, they're so overwhelmed with work in the just the economy, you know. So when we understand that in our centers, you know, we really, really have a relationship with our families, so we are able to support them in some of these difficult times with our with our entire district. You know, we have a lot of resources within our district that will support families that are struggling.

Erin Brinker: 52:02

I imagine that you have, and we have just about, I think about five minutes left. I imagine that you have a lot of students or children whose families come from a country other than the United States, and so this is their first connection to the school system here in the US. And how, you know i How does that? How does that work for you? How do you help people become comfortable with the school system and understand the school system and work with parents?

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 52:34

So when we get, you know parents from, say, Cambodia, because we just had a parent come through. And of course, they don't know how to enroll. They don't know what's required. You know, in California us. So we truly help them. We help them to adapt. We're patient with them and whatever their needs are, we help them. We try to help them as much as possible. We're not going to just assume they know what to do. We're going to guide them. And then when their child comes into our classrooms, we are going to try to build a relationship with, you know, those parents, and, of course, the child and we're going to maybe learn a few words, you know, to help them feel comfortable. Oh, that's crazy, and let them know that, you know, we embrace their culture. We embrace them,

Nancy Carrillo: 53:34

right? And in our district, it has so many they have, like a translator, so if we get a parent that calls us and sign language, right? They they only speak sign language, we have a translators that come through different language. Cambodian, you know, we have translators that we just call and they sit on the phone with us. So we try to make this process easy for the parent. We will walk them through the whole process. We will make the phone calls for them to get them in touch with how to get that birth certificate, how to get those immunizations that we need to enroll them, how to get help in obtaining their pay stubs or their electric bill. We have laptops and and iPads here that we can help them get those because we get grandparents right that have taken custody of their children, and I'm talking grandparents in their 60s or 70s who don't even know how to use a computer. So wow, right? So we're able to say, Okay, let's sit down. Let me show you how to create this account so we can pull up your Edison bill, for instance, and we will help them and sit with them during that process. We just don't say, Well, go figure it out.

Erin Brinker: 54:52

Too bad. So sad,

Nancy Carrillo: 54:53

right? Let us know when you know how to do it, right? We want to help them get that so we can get their job. Child in school. Oh, that's excellent. Get them, get them all thriving, to get even, give the grandparent a break for a moment while their child is here, learning with us, right?

Erin Brinker: 55:11

And that certainly, you know, builds trust, right? So you took the time to create an on ramp for them.

Nancy Carrillo: 55:17

These are the parents that I'm talking about. You know, we're helping grandparents. Gosh, years and years ago, at at Sierra, infant, toddler, I had a parent who, unfortunately a grandparent, who got custody for children. Unfortunately their their mother had had passed in a very ugly way, and the baby's seen it. Oh, that grandparent still is just like I remember, I remember, and when that grandparent had those difficult days, she would be so upset with me because her children's clothes were dirty that that they got mud on it. But, you know, the next day, she'd be so thankful that I was there, you know, to take care of her child when he had a fever, and I had to watch them until she could get there. So, you know, we understand, we understand the struggle that our grandparents are having, and we don't want to put a bigger burden on them. We want to be here to support you, to walk you through, and, you know, to help you help your children.

Erin Brinker: 56:20

So we have about a minute left. How do people learn more about the Child Development Services at the San Bernardino City Unified School District and enroll their children

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 56:32

so they can call us at 90988067061, more time, 909-880-6706 and we will get them started within our program. Within our program, they

Nancy Carrillo: 56:54

can also go to our website, which is SBC, USD, dot, child, Dev, C, H, I, L, d, d, e, v.com, and you will find out about our entire program. We have full day program and a half day program. We have birth to five. We want your little ones. They they will be cared for by educated, certificated credential teachers,

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 57:20

and we potty train your children who are not babysitters, right? Well, you too

Erin Brinker: 57:29

are amazing. We're completely out of time. I'm so grateful that we took this time together to tell people about the wonderful programs and about child development in general. Latasha Kelly and Nancy Carrillo, thank you for all of the incredible work that you do, and thank you for joining me today.

Dr. Latashia Kelly: 57:46

Thank you.

Erin Brinker: 57:48

Well, that is all we have time for today. I realized that I neglected to say what I'm grateful for. I started tradition last week and second week, and that tradition went out the window at the beginning. So please forgive me. So I'm going to say it now. I am grateful for fall weather, warm sweaters, extra blankets, hot tea, chicken soup, and you on this Sunday morning or whenever you are listening on podcast, please know that you are loved, you are important, and you are worthy of the good in this world. And easy life is not promised, but we aren't in it alone. Create community. You feeling lonely, volunteer somewhere, volunteer at an animal shelter, at a food bank, at a faith community, whether it's a church or synagogue or mosque or nonprofit organization that is aligned with your values and meet purpose driven people just like you. No matter your age or abilities. You can find a place. You've been listening to the making hope happen radio show and podcast. I'm Erin Brinker. If you have ideas that you think would be interesting for the show, we do a deep dive every week, please let me know. You can email me at show at making hope.org. That's show at making hope. Dot O, R, G. Have a great week. Everyone. You.